Questions about English language - Page 2 - Eternal Allegiance

RoM · 09-01-2002, 02:41 AM

but.......i don't speak they are using "you and me" so it's a mistake saying that? if it's a mistake why are they using it in a song?! *confused*

Riapanonias · 09-01-2002, 04:40 AM

well I is like
I suck. you cant say ME suck that wood be strange.

and like this one.
do you want to youn ME. you cant say do you want to youn I.

well that is how i can healp.

phatkat · 09-01-2002, 05:43 AM

Quote:

Originally posted by Ron_ganim
but.......i don't speak they are using "you and me" so it's a mistake saying that? if it's a mistake why are they using it in a song?! *confused*

english ain't the easiest language; people use it incorrectly all the time. it's not a huge deal, because a lot of times the wrong way to say something doesn't always sound wrong right away.

*shrug*

no one's perfect. i mean, i get paid to make sure others' grammar is correct...but i still make mistakes sometimes. i'm human.

for formal purposes, grammar should abide by the rules. for things like songs and everyday conversation, bending the rules a little bit is okay.

PapRoach123 · 09-01-2002, 06:45 AM

How about compromising by using the term 'you and me' in cases where extracting the 'you' would lead to the point of the sentence being lost?

Example #1: We're a great couple you and me...

Example #2: You and me, together we have a destiny...

phatkat · 09-01-2002, 07:08 AM

Quote:

Originally posted by Stinger
How about compromising by using the term 'you and me' in cases where extracting the 'you' would lead to the point of the sentence being lost?

Example #1: We're a great couple you and me...

Example #2: You and me, together we have a destiny...

those sentences are incorrect; you still need 'I'.

if you took out the 'you', the only reason the sentences wouldn't make sense is because you're talking about plural objects with a single subject. (aside from the grammar being wrong, of course.

)

I is subject (the actor; the one doing something; the part of the sentence the verb pertains to), me is object (the receiver; the one having something done to it; the part of the sentence that isn't doing the verb).

I as subject:
I am going to the store.
He and I are going to the store.
wrong: he bought it for I. (this is wrong because 'I' is the subject form of the first person. in this sentence, 'I' is acting as the object, but it can't do that because it's not the object form.)

me as object:
He bought a ball.
He bought a ball for me.
He brought it to me.
He told me.
sounds right, but technically is wrong: You and me are together. (here, 'me' is acting as a subject. grammar rules dictate that the first person object form can't be used as a subject. people do this all the time, but it's not necessarily right.)

people incorrectly use the english language all the time. the rules are pretty stringent as far as correctness goes, but we break the rules all the time. (ex: who/whom, that/which, etc.) stuff like I/me is a bit more technical, and people don't know the intricacies of the rule. that's why it's always used wrong. *shrug* but while talking informally, it really doesn't matter.

p.s. the same goes for he/she and him/her. he/she are third person subject forms, and she/him are third person object forms. i used to pick up the phone and answer "this is her" when people asked to speak to me, until my mom kept correcting me. if you invert it, it would read "her is this," which totally sounds wrong, because i'd be using the object form as subject. but once i figured out the subject/object difference, i started saying "this is she" (inverted: she is this...which is grammatically correct), and me lived happily ever after.

(er, i mean *I* lived happily ever after.

)

PastyHusty · 09-01-2002, 08:55 AM

Quote:

Originally posted by phatkat

english ain't the easiest language; people use it incorrectly all the time. it's not a huge deal, because a lot of times the wrong way to say something doesn't always sound wrong right away.

Lol, you've got that one right. There are many people living in England who don't have a clue how to lose our language properly, it is sad.

I would say that anyone from Europe on these boards has a much greater knowlege of English than a lot of people in England.

cancrojc · 09-01-2002, 03:37 PM

Well, i know when to use the "I" in the sentences from the examples ("i am..." and that kind of sentences) but im very confused with the "You and i / You and me" thing.

Yes, i saw the No Doubt thing but thats not the only place where i hear/saw it.

I see that im not the only one with this doubt so if i get to know the different i will tell you.

PapRoach123 · 09-03-2002, 02:00 PM

Quote:

Originally posted by phatkat

those sentences are incorrect; you still need 'I'.

if you took out the 'you', the only reason the sentences wouldn't make sense is because you're talking about plural objects with a single subject. (aside from the grammar being wrong, of course. )

I is subject (the actor; the one doing something; the part of the sentence the verb pertains to), me is object (the receiver; the one having something done to it; the part of the sentence that isn't doing the verb).

I as subject:
I am going to the store.
He and I are going to the store.
wrong: he bought it for I. (this is wrong because 'I' is the subject form of the first person. in this sentence, 'I' is acting as the object, but it can't do that because it's not the object form.)

me as object:
He bought a ball.
He bought a ball for me.
He brought it to me.
He told me.
sounds right, but technically is wrong: You and me are together. (here, 'me' is acting as a subject. grammar rules dictate that the first person object form can't be used as a subject. people do this all the time, but it's not necessarily right.)

people incorrectly use the english language all the time. the rules are pretty stringent as far as correctness goes, but we break the rules all the time. (ex: who/whom, that/which, etc.) stuff like I/me is a bit more technical, and people don't know the intricacies of the rule. that's why it's always used wrong. *shrug* but while talking informally, it really doesn't matter.

p.s. the same goes for he/she and him/her. he/she are third person subject forms, and she/him are third person object forms. i used to pick up the phone and answer "this is her" when people asked to speak to me, until my mom kept correcting me. if you invert it, it would read "her is this," which totally sounds wrong, because i'd be using the object form as subject. but once i figured out the subject/object difference, i started saying "this is she" (inverted: she is this...which is grammatically correct), and me lived happily ever after. (er, i mean *I* lived happily ever after. )

That sounds very logical, yes. And because I am one for the correctness of the use of the language, I'm very happy with your comments. Nobody in school ever laid that out for me like that, heh. I shall joyfully integrate the theory into my system and hopefully see some improvements on the results.